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 Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?

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John LeSurf



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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:41 pm

Yes I heard from Sky news that a anouncement will be made by the government this week to allow Thames Water to fit Water Meters across the board.If you believe the figures they say that water consumption is down
25% where meters have been fitted.The Chinese money that owns a large chunk of Thames Water shares must be rubbing their little yellow hands together as the value of Thames Shares will rocket when this is given the go ahead.Water is a commodity ,its also a vital for life itself.Would not it be better to re-nationlize Thames water and bring it back into public ownership so this mountain of profit could be invested for the public good.
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Andy Banham

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:09 pm

last thursday drove past the ressies at chingford and they were full to the brim. it may have something to do with the 2012 olympics
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Ed Randall

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Mon Apr 23, 2012 10:17 pm

Would they make more money if meters are installed? If they reduce consumption AND bills, as we are led to believe, surely TW will be not only paying to install all those meters but also collecting less money as a result - which might explain the lack of urgency to install them to-date.

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Richard Crimp
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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Mon Apr 23, 2012 11:20 pm

Check out the opposition to metering;

"But Neil Fishpool from the Campaign for Water Justice said compulsory meters would be an "outrage", which would penalise larger families and lead to lower standards [of] hygiene among the poor."

I take it Mr Fishpool - and you gotta laugh at the irony of the name - has 10 kids and expects me and everyone else to foot his water bill? In addition, I take it Mr Fishpool believes that "the poor" rarely wash and that this will only get worse once their bills are reduced?

Oh dear, Mr Fishpool smells the coffee and then orders tea...


Richard Laughing
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John LeSurf



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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:00 pm

Ed Randall wrote:
Would they make more money if meters are installed? If they reduce consumption AND bills, as we are led to believe, surely TW will be not only paying to install all those meters but also collecting less money as a result - which might explain the lack of urgency to install them to-date.
A case of swings and roundabouts Ed,a factory owner near our base ten years ago with 75,000 sq ft of premises and ten workers ,two loo,s and tea making washroom facilities was paying £3000.00 per year water rates,he had a water meter fitted ,commercial premises at his own expense(£500.) and reduced his bill to £300.per year.,at the same time the water companies made compulsary fitting of water meters to domestic houses at the water companies expense and increased the average yearly bill for a family of FOUR by 50%.There is a lot more domestic property than commercial.The Hotel group as mentioned with the bore hole went to the expense of drilling a bore hole to dramaticly decrease thier water bill and not out of the concern for water usage.
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Ed Randall

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Tue Apr 24, 2012 9:36 pm

A couple of people I know have had meters fitted at home, one of them has young kids and a washing machine running all day, both said that their bills decreased after switching to a meter.
The Thames website says that you can change your mind within 12 months and switch back to unmetered if you find it's more expensive. Can't lose! I think I might go for it. http://www.thameswater.co.uk/cps/rde/xchg/prod/hs.xsl/609.htm

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David Harvey

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:35 pm

Very pleased to see this, been a while




http://riverconditions.environment-agency.gov.uk//
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Barry Kneller

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:50 pm

Roding is up to 1.6m (12 midday today) - that's 1.3m above it's 'normal' level.

The most annoying thing about this is that 95% of that water will go to waste - if the RSOL's that extract all the water above Ongar would just build some large reservoirs they'd collect enough water this week to see 'em right through the summer.

Virtually all the large farms in south Essex have one or more reservoirs - those in the north of the county should do the same.

Then maybe the Roding could be as good as it was decades ago.

Lets hope that illegal weir at Passingford gets swept away..........
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David Harvey

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:20 pm

That is the big problem Barry, lack of infrastructure and new capacity being created.

One reason is campaign groups against them http://www.abingdonreservoir.org.uk/

Did hear today that we are potentially getting some recharge of groundwater levels, so lets hope for more of the same and long may it rain.
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Andy Banham

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PostSubject: Drouight greatest threat to our rivers   Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:22 pm

River Roding been around 0.30-0.40m this winter today at 1.63m jiust below flooding is possible. summer 2011 lowest level 0.26m
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Steve Appleford



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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:36 pm

Hope this flood needed as it is don`t wash a load of vunerable fry out to sea ,potential to wipe out a year class from the early spawners??
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James Mitchell

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:01 pm

Steve Appleford wrote:
Hope this flood needed as it is don`t wash a load of vunerable fry out to sea ,potential to wipe out a year class from the early spawners??

I was thinking exactly the same thing Steve. Whilst all this rain is a good thing for the river overall, and the environment generally, I wonder how much disruption it is causing to fish that are breeding and the eggs and fry that result. Presumably, fry can hole up more tightly in slacks and remaining shallows etc, but this would presumably make them very vulnerable to predation.
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Steve Appleford



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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:46 pm

James just come back from our mooring on the kennet and behind every boat in the slack water there are fry dimpling the surface so some do find refuge ,She [the Kennet ius a brown swirly mess on the lower reaches ,Where we used to moor on a typical Thames marina style gravel pit connected to the main river it was like a gian t aquarium full of fry in the summer so areas that have these should be fine but other streches...who knows?? Hopefully she will calm down quick after the much needed flush through but i guess the fate of some of the fry is in the lap of the gods Steve
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James Mitchell

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:07 pm

Well thats good news thanks for the update Steve.

My favourite thing about getting back on the bank on June 16 is always seeing the fry in the shallows and the tiny yearlings coming out to take a single maggot. Makes me quite philosophical sometimes seeing the life cycle come full circle, the river really is a magical place when it comes alive again like that and you can see the result with your own eyes.
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David Harvey

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Sun Apr 29, 2012 3:48 pm

Chaps a sea of Red down the Thames..

http://riverconditions.environment-agency.gov.uk/
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James Annear



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PostSubject: drought-the greatest threat to our rivers   Sun Apr 29, 2012 4:12 pm

All the way to the North sea.
we dont need any reservoirs do we
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David Harvey

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:43 pm

http://thameswater.co.uk/waterwisely/index.htm

And one from the Twitterati at the EA, top boys


UK rainfall map for April http://twitpic.com/9fl0yo
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Ed Randall

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Mon Apr 30, 2012 2:21 pm

Went out for a walk yesterday afternoon around 17:00 - 19:30 when the rain had stopped and the sun came out. The weir sluices at Richmond were fully open and the river was belting along out towards the sea. I thought we must have missed the top of the tide and it was going out again, but Matthew insisted the river was higher when we left than it had been when we arrived, and he was right. High tide yesterday evening was around 20:30. On a normal day the gates wouldn't have opened until 18:30 but were fully open at least an hour early, the flow was such that the incoming tide was unable to reverse the flow direction. Incredible.

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David Harvey

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:12 pm

Thats amazing Ed, and still more to come down seeing the flood levels on the tribs and seriously wet tomorrow.

A good article about water usage on Waterbriefing...

http://www.waterbriefing.org/index.php/home/water-issues/item/5642-public-not-getting-the-message-on-water-issues

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David Harvey

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Tue May 01, 2012 2:54 pm

Comment from Thames Water today

http://www.thameswater.co.uk/cps/rde/xchg/corp/hs.xsl/15600.htm

The hosepipe ban will remain in place despite London and the Thames Valley receiving more than double the historic long-term average rainfall for April, Britain’s biggest water company said today.
Thames Water said a very soggy April still had not repaired the shortfall left by below-average rainfall for 20 of the previous 25 months.

Richard Aylard, Thames Water’s director of sustainability and external affairs, said:
“We can certainly understand why some people are puzzled when they see a big red bus go by with ‘WE ARE IN DROUGHT’ emblazoned across its flanks… with puddles everywhere and monsoon-like rain cascading from the heavens.

“Yes, we have had a seriously soggy April. We had more than double the rain we would expect the last month. In fact, it hasn’t really stopped raining since we and six other companies imposed ‘hosepipe bans’ on April 5. We are alive to this irony, and our contribution to the endless talking point that is the British weather.
“But it took the two driest years since records began for us to get into this drought and one wet month, even one as wet as April, will not be enough to get us out of it. Last month’s downpours will wipe out the shortfall for the last couple of months, but not all the dry months before that. So although April’s rain has not got us out of jail, it has loosened the locks slightly.”


River flows in the Thames region have been boosted, albeit temporarily. The Pang, in Berkshire, had dried up completely. But today, following April's rain, it was flowing again with water that has run off nearby fields.
In a normal year, groundwater provides a base flow for rivers across our region, so even if there are many dry months the rivers still flow with water from underground.

After such a long dry period, groundwater levels are exceptionally low, leading to only a minimal base flow in the river. When the current rain stops the Pang, like other rivers in our region, will drop rapidly again.

"The recent rain is a temporary and welcome boost for the environment and wildlife, not a long-term fix for water supply,” Aylard said.

“It’s been so dry for so long that the soil is acting is like a hard, old sponge right now. First of all rain just runs off it, then it takes time to get damp and then fully wet, and only after that does any water seep down to boost the natural underground reserves.
"And as soon as the weather warms up, the dampness will disappear due to evaporation and rapidly growing plants.

"Until groundwater levels are restored to normal, which is unlikely to happen until we have sustained winter rainfall, we remain susceptible to further periods of prolonged dry weather, so we have to be cautious.”
A real benefit of April’s rain has been to reduce the likelihood of the company needing to impose more serious restrictions later in the year. But it is likely that the current temporary use ban, or ‘hosepipe ban,’ will need to remain in place for the rest of the year.

April’s rain has provided a short-term boost to river flows, which has allowed Thames Water to get its reservoirs to 100% full, and keep them there for the time being, but it has not delivered the long-term solution.

Mr Aylard added: "And of course for our customers who have been flooded by the recent heavy rain this is a massive problem. That's why right now we have specialist teams dealing with both the immediate issues of flooding and the longer-term prospects if the weather turns dry again."
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Steve Holmes



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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Tue May 01, 2012 5:24 pm

Richard Aylard came across well in that statement I thought.

We have a lot of dealings with him as a club so it's good for us he speaks plain sense...and that he's an angler.

Nice to hear the River Pang up Steve Appleford's way has water in it now. Was bare earth even in the winter during the snow melt.
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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Tue May 01, 2012 6:40 pm

Interesting, though they are "right up there", Thames Water are actually not quite the very worst at leaks as a percentage of water supplied: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17622837

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David Harvey

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Wed May 02, 2012 8:50 pm

First post on this thread was Sep last year, we knew there was a problem, maybe anglers should be running the country Smile
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Steve Holmes



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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Wed May 02, 2012 11:22 pm

Essex and Suffolk leak the least according to that chart posted by Ed and surprise surprise, the Essex boys at work say there's no hosepipe ban there.

If Thames Water leaked as little as Essex they wouldn't have to abstract so much water from the Thames and it might actually flow.
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David Harvey

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PostSubject: Re: Drought - The Greatest threat to our rivers?   Wed May 02, 2012 11:51 pm

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